Jefferson Meets A.I.

Night watchman: you would be astonished by many aspects of the modern university that you founded with the University of Virginia.

Jefferson: That is most fascinating. "How many students attend today?"

Night Watchman: "Mr. Jefferson, the University of Virginia now has roughly twenty-five thousand students, including undergraduate and graduate students."

Jefferson: "Twenty-five thousand! Why, sir, that is a town, not a college!” When my original university opened, there were only a few dozen students.

Night watchmen: you might find it interesting that Women first began attending in the late nineteenth century, and today make up about half the student body."

Jefferson: "I confess that would have surprised many of my contemporaries.” Yes, it certainly appears that society has changed dramatically after my lifetime.

Transcript

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This podcast blends history and imagination. Real historical figures appear alongside fictional situations and imagined conversations. While based on historical research, portions of the program are dramatized for storytelling purposes. This podcast blends history and imagination.

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Real historical figures appear alongside fictional situations and imagined conversations.

SPEAKER_00 0:42

While based on historical research, portions of the program are dramatized for storytelling purposes.

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Welcome to the Hall of Imagination, where the figures of history have stories to tell. And this specific episode is called Thomas Jefferson Meets AI. We begin this third and final episode of a conversation with Thomas Jefferson by asking, Mr. Jefferson, would you be astonished by uh many aspects of the modern university that she founded with the University of Virginia? That is most fascinating. Uh, how many students attend today, by the way? Well, Mr. Jefferson, uh the University of Virginia now has roughly twenty-five thousand students, including undergraduate and graduate students. Mr. Bartley, twenty-five thousand? Why, sir, that is a town, not a college. When my original university opened, there were only a few dozen students. Well, Mr. Jefferson, you might find it interesting that women first began attending in the late nineteenth century, and today make up about half the student body. Well, Mr. Bartley, I confess uh that would have surprised many of my contemporaries. Yes, it certainly appears that society has changed dramatically after my lifetime. Yes, Mr. Jefferson, uh, that seems to be a fair assessment. Tell me, Mr. Bartley, do students still study the classics? Uh some do. Uh students still study Greek, Latin, philosophy, and history. But uh they also study subjects that uh I doubt existed during your day. Mr. Bartley, what do you mean by subjects that did not exist? Well, for one, computer science, then artificial intelligence, and definitely biomedical engineering. Artificial intelligence? You must explain that one to me very carefully. Well, Mr. Jefferson, it might be a good idea for me to wait a little bit later to try and explain that one. Well then uh what has become of the lawn? Well, the lawn is still there, Mr. Jefferson. Students still walk it every day. The rotunda still stands. In fact, people regard the lawn as one of the most beautiful university spaces in America. Then perhaps I have not entirely failed. But Mr. Bartley, pray tell me, what subjects are considered most important now? Well, today students study business, medicine, engineering, law, computer science, and public policy. And Mr. Bartley, what of citizenship? Well, Mr. Jefferson, people still talk about it, though perhaps not as often as you might like. Then, Mr. Bartley, there definitely remains work to be done. Now, do students still read books? And I certainly hope you answer in the affirmative. Well, of course, Mr. Jefferson. But Mr. Bartley, then why are they all staring into those glowing rectangles? Well, Mr. Jefferson, they are telephones. Telephones. Well, they're also libraries, newspapers, maps, post offices, theaters, and occasionally telephones. I I should like to examine one immediately. Now now I as I understand it, Mr. Bartley, you attended the University of Virginia yourself. Could you address your concentration of study? Uh certainly, Mr. Jefferson. I studied drama and you might be interested to know that the university has now ha now has a thriving theater department with student productions and departments devoted to the arts. I am very glad to hear that, Mr. Bartley. I I strongly believe that an education should develop the whole person and not just train someone for a profession. Uh but uh let us return to a subject that is most confusing and that discipline is one that I have heard mentioned in the museum. And it is the study of artificial intelligence. Sir, I I confess the the phrase sounds like a contradiction. Intelligence is the province of the human mind. Well, Mr. Jefferson, that's what a lot of folks say. But these days we have machines that can recognize speech, answer questions, translate languages, and even help people write books or compose music. Mr. Bartley, compose music? Are you telling me a machine possesses imagination? Well, Mr. Jefferson, not exactly. It doesn't think or dream the way people do. It learns from huge amounts of information and can recognize patterns and put things together in useful ways. Then, Mr. Bartley, you say it's it's rather like a very diligent secretary with a remarkably large library. Well, Mr. Jefferson, that's that's not a bad comparison. And this secretary never sleeps and has access to more libraries than you and I can possibly imagine. Well, does this mechanical secretary ever make mistakes, Mr. Bartley? Unfortunately, Mr. Jefferson, every day. Ah, then I begin to understand. It resembles Congress. Well, Mr. Jefferson, you might say that. Uh could you address the size of the library from which the machine draws its knowledge? Well, Mr. Jefferson, it's definitely larger than the Library of Congress. Larger than the Library of Congress? Y your Library of Congress, by the way, was based on the library that I gave them myself, and that was over six thousand books. But Mr. Jefferson, this is much, much larger. Good heavens. And where do you keep such a collection? Uh mostly, Mr. Jefferson, in computers. Then I should like very much to see one. Well, I can do better than that. I I can let you talk to one. Talk to one, Mr. Bartley? Yes, Mr. Jefferson. Does it speak French? Uh yes, I would say so. Latin? Some. What about Greek? Some. What about English? Oh, of course, Mr. Jefferson. Then perhaps I may ask it. Perhaps I may ask it a question. Well, what would you ask? I I should ask whether mankind has become wiser. And Mr. Jefferson, and if it said no, uh then uh Mr. Bartley, I should inquire whether mankind has at least become kinder. Well, Mr. Jefferson, that might be hard to judge. Well, tell me honestly, my friend, are you afraid of this artificial intelligence? No, sir, Mr. Jefferson. But I try not to expect too much from it. Certainly a wise attitude. Every generation imagines its inventions will either save civilization or destroy it. In truth, they generally do neither. It is men and women, not machines, who determine whether knowledge is used for good or ill. Well, Mr. Jefferson, that is very well said. Tell me, my friend, this artificial intelligence with which you converse, does it claim to possess wisdom? Not really, Mr. Jefferson. It mostly claims to be helpful. A most modest beginning. And does it know everything? No, no, sir. It it definitely makes mistakes. Excellent. Then it is more human than I expected. You know, Mr. Jefferson, uh some people are afraid it it will replace us. Mr. Bartley, replace mankind? Nonsense. A library has never replaced a reader. A telescope has never replaced an astronomer, and a plough has never replaced a farmer. Tools change civilization, but they do not excuse us from thinking. Well, Mr. Jefferson, that's that's really what I was hoping you'd say. Then let me ask you one final question. Mr. Jefferson, yes, what what is that? Mr. Bartley, has this artificial intelligence made men and women more curious? Well, Mr. Jefferson, I would think so. You see, almost everyone today, and that would probably that would probably apply to anyone who's a student or professor at the University of Virginia, has access to a device called a personal computer that is connected to almost every other computer around the world in some way, and theoretically gives that person access to everyone else. Then, Mr. Bartley, perhaps there is reason for hope. Though I am astonished that anyone with one of these computers could publish so-called news to anyone without owning a printing press. Well, precisely, Mr. Mr. Jefferson. And and Mr. Jefferson, not to change the subject, uh, which is a phrase that is commonly used when one desires to change the subject. Allow me to point out that uh there are some coincidences and coincidences in history that almost seem too remarkable to believe. Yes, Mr. Bartley, fifty years after the Declaration of Independence was adopted, I was nearing the end of my long and extraordinary life. Could that be what you're talking about? Yes, Mr. Jefferson. You see, on July the 4th, 1826, the 50th anniversary of the Declaration itself, I quietly passed away at Monticello. What makes the story even more remarkable is that my old friend and sometimes political rival, John Adams, died the very same day, only a few hours later. Perhaps there is something fitting about that. I believe that I helped give voice to the ideals proclaimed on the 4th of July, and half a century later I departed on the very day the nation paused to celebrate them. And so, Mr. Jefferson, as fireworks fill the sky and families gather to celebrate America's birthday, it might be worth remembering the man who with pen in hand wrote words that still echo across the centuries. We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal. You know, for Thomas Jefferson, the Fourth of July was not simply a date on the calendar. It was the beginning of a nation, and in a remarkable twist of history, it became the final page of his earthly story as well. Well, Mr Mr. Barnley, I have often wondered whether Providence possesses a sense of drama. To begin your podcast episodes about me with the Fourth of July and to depart on the Fourth of July. Why that almost seems the sort of ending a playwright might choose. In conclusion, permit me to say that while I have long since departed this earthly stage, every 4th of July I hear once more the voices of children, the laughter of families, and the ringing of bells, and I'm reminded that while men pass away, ideas, if they are worthy, may outlive us all. And with that, the lights in the hall of imagination grew quiet once more. Outside, somewhere over the cities of the United States, fireworks were beginning to bloom in the night sky, and I couldn't help thinking that maybe old Mr. Jefferson had chosen the perfect time for his final curtain call. Join Celebrate Creativity and the Hall of Imagination for the beginning of a three-part series about the life of Frederick Douglass.